coastie Posted September 8, 2006 Share Posted September 8, 2006 Hi all Im new to the sport of luring for bream and was wandering if someone could tell me why people double there briad before tying a leader? And what benefit it has? Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 8, 2006 Share Posted September 8, 2006 Hi all Im new to the sport of luring for bream and was wandering if someone could tell me why people double there briad before tying a leader? And what benefit it has? Cheers I dont double mine and never have had any trouble Cheers Stewy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wettingaline Posted September 8, 2006 Share Posted September 8, 2006 Hey mate, I think whole idea of doubling braid when tying knots to leaders is to make the braid thicker so it doesnt cut through the leader, making the knot stronger... I usually doouble the braid when tying onto the leader just for peace of mind but its not necasary...doubling will also make your knot thicker and may catch on the guides affecting your casting abilty. Cheers Joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hawkeye Posted September 8, 2006 Share Posted September 8, 2006 I think a lot of people just always use a double i always use one when fishing where your going to be tracing the fish as it means extra strength between the reel and the fish if something goes wrong. but as the guys have said not nessecary for light bream style and if your tying a spider hitch not a bimini or plat your acually weakening your line a lot Hawkeye Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bashir Posted September 8, 2006 Share Posted September 8, 2006 because marlin sometimes hit their soft plastics. They are pointless and anybody that ties a double for bream is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FletcherG1991 Posted September 8, 2006 Share Posted September 8, 2006 i tie my braid straight to leader..... would the double be twice as visable underwater ?..... the only time i tie a double in braib is when where out game fishing and out a couple of smaller rods out to see if we can get some stripies for live or dead bait.....when i do that i use a bimini twist put a swivel on the end and clip the lure straight on which is pre riged with 150lb trace..... that way i can put some hurt on the fish and get him onboard quickly.....but other than that i dont tie doubles in any of my braid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flattieman Posted September 9, 2006 Share Posted September 9, 2006 (edited) I double the number of wraps on the braid (I tie a double uni knot), but don't double the braid itself. to Fishraider, coastie. Flattieman. Edited September 9, 2006 by Flattieman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coastie Posted September 9, 2006 Author Share Posted September 9, 2006 Thankyou for your help... I dont think i'll bother learning the technique. Cheers Coastie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjbink Posted September 9, 2006 Share Posted September 9, 2006 Coastie, Its well worth tying a double (bimini) in your braid. If you hook a big oyster cracking bream near a lease you will need all the strength you can get. Also bigger fish than bream eat soft plastics. Plenty of jewies have been hooked on bream gear. Its saved me a few lures too as well as wasting time re-rigging. With 4lb braid and 4kg leader the jig hook usually straightens on a snag before the leader knot will break if you incorporate a double. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stafford Posted September 22, 2006 Share Posted September 22, 2006 Coastie, Its well worth tying a double (bimini) in your braid. If you hook a big oyster cracking bream near a lease you will need all the strength you can get. Also bigger fish than bream eat soft plastics. Plenty of jewies have been hooked on bream gear. Its saved me a few lures too as well as wasting time re-rigging. With 4lb braid and 4kg leader the jig hook usually straightens on a snag before the leader knot will break if you incorporate a double. Hi Billfisher, The only time you would really need to double your braid is if the quality of you leader is poor, a lot of you wouldn't know this but fluorocarbon has a shelf life, when you buy it burn it and it should go black from memory if it doesn't then the shelf life has expired, just be careful, also for the sake of a couple of extra dollars buy quality, I use a 4lb leader most of the time while fishing moored boats and have never had a problem. I have never had my braid cut my leader either, also the best way to fish racks is to use a 2500 reel with 8lb braid as the 8lb diameter aids in a stronger knot when using 8-10lb leaders. In my experiences. Jason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jewel Posted September 22, 2006 Share Posted September 22, 2006 (edited) I currently run 4lb PE and use leaders from 4-12 lb depending on the application, in my experience I have found that using doubled line (not necessarilly a true gamefishing double) will depend on the braid you are using. The (so called high end) jap PE Im using at the moment needs a doubled line to not cut through the leader under good pressure (razor, nitlon and vanish). I find the problem less so with fireline or FINS. The issue seems to almost disappear when you jump up to 6lb braid as do wind knots. Out of convenience Im tying a short double (approx 12') with a spider hitch which seems to give me full strength of the line(as it is the length of the fight, rather than the knots integrity that weakens this knot....... and bream fights are not very long) ie the leader or knot will not pop before the line/or the hook straightens. I would be more concerned about being spooled by a marlin than it wearing through the leader or controlling it at the boat on bream gear! This system seems to work OK. Edited September 22, 2006 by Jewel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest danielinbyron Posted September 22, 2006 Share Posted September 22, 2006 I WAS DOING IT AND I HAVE STOPPED ..contrary to popular belief.. a double in your mainline will only offer an increase in strenghth when the knot has been taken up a couple of turns on to the spool.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BBM Rick Posted September 22, 2006 Share Posted September 22, 2006 I currently run 4lb PE and use leaders from 4-12 lb depending on the application, in my experience I have found that using doubled line (not necessarilly a true gamefishing double) will depend on the braid you are using. The (so called high end) jap PE Im using at the moment needs a doubled line to not cut through the leader under good pressure (razor, nitlon and vanish). I find the problem less so with fireline or FINS. The issue seems to almost disappear when you jump up to 6lb braid as do wind knots. What brand of PE are you running Jewel, and how have you found it? Is it holding its colour? I have just spooled a couple of reels with the Jap brand Bass Hard, but am yet to put it to a decent test. Be interested to hear what other PE others have used/tried. Rick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jewel Posted September 22, 2006 Share Posted September 22, 2006 BBM using the same........ not overly impressed Colour holding is not really an issue, but knot strength is. Overall I am finding FINS more reliable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjbink Posted September 22, 2006 Share Posted September 22, 2006 I WAS DOING IT AND I HAVE STOPPED ..contrary to popular belief.. a double in your mainline will only offer an increase in strenghth when the knot has been taken up a couple of turns on to the spool.. What knot are you using for the double? The bimini twist is 100% strength knot. Also you should use double or more the amout of turns if tying it with braid (ie 40 or more turns). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grantm Posted September 23, 2006 Share Posted September 23, 2006 Ive recently started using an improved albright knot as opposed to a double uni (where a double in the mainline is used sometimes), which totally negates the need to double the mainline in the knot. Working well so far and has a much smaller overall knot for easy casting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest danielinbyron Posted September 23, 2006 Share Posted September 23, 2006 (edited) poeple think that a double gives you extra strength ,, of course it doesn't until after the knot is on the spool.. therefore the length of the double should be two turns around your spool through your guides and reach the water where you will land, net , gaff or trace your fish.. if that needs further PONTIFICATION OR explanation: yeah they are the figures , that a bimani with enough turns is 100% knot strength in braid. BUT 100% OF WHAT. here is the logic : say you have 40lb line you tie a double,, after the knot you effectively have 80lb... at the back of the knot you have 80lb suddenly{or spread over a centremetre or so} becoming 40lb.... this is your new weekest point.... the purpose of these knots is to spread the load across a wider area..at the fulcrum.. still there is a change in the load on a part of the line.and unless the knot is perfect that space where the load is shifted will be smaller than intended..creating a weak spot.. but hey if you think thats compensated for with the binding effect of the knot ,and you got em down , forget that read on. So even if the knot is 100% strength ...it is only, and can only be tested as 100% of 40lb.. we all know that a chain is only as strong as its weekest link.. therefore until that double knot is on your spool for a couple of turns it is serving next to no purpose...except maybe an increase in abrasion resistence . so back to the thread of line to leader: There is some evidence to support that a spider hitch {my preferred double for mono} in braid causes a decrease in strenghth up to 60%.. so its definately not the crack. i use the uni leader knot as it is more simple .. instead of doubling the braid i may increase its turns but lately with the help of a couple of sharks and some bombees i have found that 5 turns both on braid and leader is pretty reliable. As long as the not is wetted and pulled tight to sit neat before trimmed.. Edited September 23, 2006 by danielinbyron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjbink Posted September 24, 2006 Share Posted September 24, 2006 Danielynbyron, Yes, but the point of doubling the braid is to increase the knot strength of the mono leader to braid knot. These mono to braid knots are fairly low in knot strength. Using your example of 40lb braid lets say that the leader knot is 70% strength. Your 40lb main line is now reduced to 28lb. But if you double the braid then you theoretically have 70% of 80lb ie 56lb knot strength. Ie the knot is stronger than the main line so you have no weakness in the system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest danielinbyron Posted September 24, 2006 Share Posted September 24, 2006 Danielynbyron, Yes, but the point of doubling the braid is to increase the knot strength of the mono leader to braid knot. These mono to braid knots are fairly low in knot strength. Using your example of 40lb braid lets say that the leader knot is 70% strength. Your 40lb main line is now reduced to 28lb. But if you double the braid then you theoretically have 70% of 80lb ie 56lb knot strength. Ie the knot is stronger than the main line so you have no weakness in the system. would it figure then to be the same if you just folded the braid before tying it..skipping the double??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjbink Posted September 24, 2006 Share Posted September 24, 2006 would it figure then to be the same if you just folded the braid before tying it..skipping the double??? It would help but not as good as a tied double. I fold the line some times when tying knots in mono line and it does help knot strength. Its is also a good idea when you are joining lines of unequal diammeter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hawkeye Posted September 30, 2006 Share Posted September 30, 2006 Guys if the strength of the double knot is any sort of issue a spider hitch is the worst knot in the world reduces the breaking strain of the main like to below 50% theres a reason game fishing guys tie bimini and 30 wrap plaits Hawkeye Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest danielinbyron Posted September 30, 2006 Share Posted September 30, 2006 Guys if the strength of the double knot is any sort of issue a spider hitch is the worst knot in the world reduces the breaking strain of the main like to below 50% theres a reason game fishing guys tie bimini and 30 wrap plaits Hawkeye In defence of the spider hitch.. When land based fishing your double should be as long as { two turns around your spool and to the water at your landing point..} the inherant weekness of the spider hitch isn't as applicable to mono as braid... it is a little bit tricky tying a 16ft double bimini on the rocks by yourself in the wind.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Big-Banana Posted October 6, 2006 Share Posted October 6, 2006 I double as I dont trust my braid to mono knots. Never let me down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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