jew fish, size increase and closed season

[bassboy888]

Was just reading an opinion article on the fishing world web site (Hawkesbury Jewies) and was wondering what peoples opinion on this sought of thing would be like. Personally i think some of the suggestions are a great idea for the future populations of jewies, and could probably be implemented into various other systems around NSW.

Those are just my thoughts, what do other raiders think

Cheers Bassboy

Edited May 3, 2012 by bassboy888

[tumra]

do have the option to keeping the status quo...????

[Luringbream]

Size limits for certain species have been debated for years on end. It appears the size limit will be increased to 75cm. Many will agree, alot more will disagree. A fishermans inability to catch his bag or a larger model of jewfish shouldn't be the basis of why we should all panic and raise the size limit to 75cm. If anything, i'm catching more jewfish and bigger jewfish now than ever before at times and methods i never would have believed if you told me 10 years ago (ie. middle of the day, on plastics/hardbodies).

This change will not affect me, as i catch all my jewfish in the river and harbour and don't like to eat from there, but with this will come the confidence and backing to make more idiot changes to other species such as squid, kingfish, dolphinfish, blue eye etc. Won't be a happy day, when there is a size limit on squid or a bag limit of 10!

Revise your poll with a 'do nothing' option.

[barnzey]

Size limits for certain species have been debated for years on end. It appears the size limit will be increased to 75cm. Many will agree, alot more will disagree. A fishermans inability to catch his bag or a larger model of jewfish shouldn't be the basis of why we should all panic and raise the size limit to 75cm. If anything, i'm catching more jewfish and bigger jewfish now than ever before at times and methods i never would have believed if you told me 10 years ago (ie. middle of the day, on plastics/hardbodies).

This change will not affect me, as i catch all my jewfish in the river and harbour and don't like to eat from there, but with this will come the confidence and backing to make more idiot changes to other species such as squid, kingfish, dolphinfish, blue eye etc. Won't be a happy day, when there is a size limit on squid or a bag limit of 10!

Revise your poll with a 'do nothing' option.

So what do you say about the nsw fisheries 2011 stock status report that catergorises jewfish as 'overfished'?

Some key phrases from the report:

-Mulloway is also a very significant species in the recreational fishery, and catches by this sector are much larger than commercial landings

-Spawning potential ratio for mulloway is well below the recommended threshold of 25%

-In NSW size for 50% maturity for males was estimated at 51cm, and for females at 68cm.

I think raising the minimum length to 65cm and decreasing the bag limit to 3 fish would help stocks recover to the status 'fully fished'. I think all fish should have the chance to breed at least once before hitting the dinner plate so I've set my own min size limit at 65-70cm. In the future the 5 bag limit could be reinstated once number of jewies out there increases.

[Spooooled]

So what do you say about the nsw fisheries 2011 stock status report that catergorises jewfish as 'overfished'?

Some key phrases from the report:

-Mulloway is also a very significant species in the recreational fishery, and catches by this sector are much larger than commercial landings

-Spawning potential ratio for mulloway is well below the recommended threshold of 25%

-In NSW size for 50% maturity for males was estimated at 51cm, and for females at 68cm.

I think raising the minimum length to 65cm and decreasing the bag limit to 3 fish would help stocks recover to the status 'fully fished'. I think all fish should have the chance to breed at least once before hitting the dinner plate so I've set my own min size limit at 65-70cm. In the future the 5 bag limit could be reinstated once number of jewies out there increases.

tops i agree

[andrew399]

there is no way that the rec catch is bigger than the commercial catch! Id support a size increase though...

[hambo692]

Should/ could the 'increased bag limit' be decreased bag limit?

[Gyro]

Hi this is what i wrote to David Lockwood of the Sun Hearald Dear David i am sending this email about the jewfish and other so called by catch caught by mid north coast pros .The fisherman are now going out of their way to target these fish because of the low price of mullet . These fisherman are absolutely annihilating these species. Where we used to catch travelling blackfish and bream regularly at this time of year there are just none about. As for jewfish they have been hammering them for the at least 3 years the reefs we would regularly catch these fish are now barren. I feel these fisherman should not be allowed to be able to use beach haul nets other than for mullet . Fisheries soon winge about the amount of fish the recs catch but why don't they do something about these blokes who are stuffing the fishing for all of us.

You say that these fisherman have to make a living but what's the good if there are no fish left for anyone which will happen because it has already started.

Regards Gyro

[Gyro]

Hi this was David Lockwoods answer HI DAVID

I missed the Herald on how things are progressing would it be possible that you may be able to send a copy by email to me

From: David Lockwood I was wondering if you are interested in the under sized prawn situation up this way let me know and i will get more information for you Thanks Kevin

Sent: Sunday, July 18, 2010 10:48 AM

To: Blueflashboats

Subject: Re: Reply to Sun Herald

Thanks Kevin,

I agree it's wrong and have a lot of documentation here. The big jewies are all female breeders. I understand how these people think: short-term gain. And where there are kids and mortgages, they are after the quick buck. But as you say, it's in THEIR interests not to target these fish and wipe-out the big breeders. It's their future too. One haul probably represents 50 years of angler catches of a lifetime.

I'm raising the issue now with the intention of following it through with fisheries managers and authorities.

tight lines,

DL

On 18/07/2010, at 10:39 AM, Blueflashboats wrote:

Dear David i am sending this email about the jewfish and other so called by catch caught by mid north coast pros .The fisherman are now going out of their way to target these fish because of the low price of mullet . These fisherman are absolutely annihilating these species. Where we used to catch travelling blackfish and bream regularly at this time of year there are just none about. As for jewfish they have been hammering them for the at least 3 years the reefs we would regularly catch these fish are now barren. I feel these fisherman should not be allowed to be able to use beach haul nets other than for mullet . Fisheries soon winge about the amount of fish the recs catch but why don't they do something about these blokes who are stuffing the fishing for all of us.

You say that these fisherman have to make a living but what's the good if there are no fish left for anyone which will happen because it has already started.

Regards Kevin

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[bassboy888]

Should/ could the 'increased bag limit' be decreased bag limit?

Thanks for noticing the fault. my bad haha

[outdoordan]

Size limits for certain species have been debated for years on end. It appears the size limit will be increased to 75cm. Many will agree, alot more will disagree. A fishermans inability to catch his bag or a larger model of jewfish shouldn't be the basis of why we should all panic and raise the size limit to 75cm. If anything, i'm catching more jewfish and bigger jewfish now than ever before at times and methods i never would have believed if you told me 10 years ago (ie. middle of the day, on plastics/hardbodies).

Revise your poll with a 'do nothing' option.

The reason for considering these conservation options is not because reco fisherman can't catch thier bag. The Mulloway stocks are declining, they have be steadily declining for the past 30 years. You only need to look at the pros reported catches in that period to see this trend. This species has had too much presure for too long. Action must be taken before the stocks are unable to recover.

To take the DO NOTHING approach is ignorant, irresponsible and morally arse up!

Everyone carries on these days about releasing big flatties (which i agree with). "they are the breeders"......etc. even though flatties almost plauge our esturies. Or catch and release fishing for bream and bass. But when a mulloway is caught, even a juvenile 50cm model which hasn't had the chance to breed, it is killed and boasted about like it is some great achievement. Its about time anglers are educated about this species and begin to apply the same moral judgement as we are seeing with flatties, bream and bass!

+ =

[Luringbream]

The reason for considering these conservation options is not because reco fisherman can't catch thier bag. The Mulloway stocks are declining, they have be steadily declining for the past 30 years. You only need to look at the pros reported catches in that period to see this trend. This species has had too much presure for too long. Action must be taken before the stocks are unable to recover.

To take the DO NOTHING approach is ignorant, irresponsible and morally arse up!

Everyone carries on these days about releasing big flatties (which i agree with). "they are the breeders"......etc. even though flatties almost plauge our esturies. Or catch and release fishing for bream and bass. But when a mulloway is caught, even a juvenile 50cm model which hasn't had the chance to breed, it is killed and boasted about like it is some great achievement. Its about time anglers are educated about this species and begin to apply the same moral judgement as we are seeing with flatties, bream and bass!

+ =

Hi dan,

As mentioned previously, this change won't affect me, so i'm not going to waste my time going into any depth on this particular species. Fullstop. No further conversation in regards to jewfish shall be directed at me nor discussed with me, as simply, that is not the message i was conveying.

What i will say though, is that with this change, there will be unneccesary changes and restrictions placed on other species (without notice and without consultation). When they have strong backing behind there proposed actions/decisions, they will abuse that power and enforce new laws on a number of additional species and mediums. We have seen this happen time before. At the moment there is speculation about a number of species having further restrictions(kings to 75cm, squid to 10, blue eye to 2 and the list continues), including methods of fishing (ie. banning of electric reels).

Based on their research on this specific species (which i am yet to see anywhere), they speculate and propose restrictions to the bag/size limits and even in this case, closure zones/seasons. Some i agree with, some i dont (each to there own).

Take Snapper for example. There has not been any significant increase in numbers or average sizes since the size limit increase many years ago. It will be the same for jewfish and several other species.

If you've ever caught a jewfish, you'd know that hardly anyone keeps anything under 75cm because they taste like soap(hence the name 'soapies'). There are a minority that do though! The more feasible and sensible approach would be to restrict bag limits only. A bit of education for you: Us rec fisho's dont take 1% of what the pro's do, a single day of a pro would account for a year of rec catches combined. Hence my conclusion of 'do nothing', to the recreational limits. By all means, target the pro's, but to rave and rant and support this when there is no factual evidence that 'recreational fisherman are destroying jewfish stocks' or 'increasing bag limits will increase average numbers of species', is naive. Each to their own i guess.

Edited May 4, 2012 by Luringbream

[outdoordan]

Your statement has knobs all over it...

Here's a bit of education for you Mulloway status Pay close attention to table 2.3. on the comparison between recreational and commercial catches. Now i don't confess to be a mathematician, but its is a little more than 1%. What is also interesting to note is the mean size of the fish caught. If you continue reading it states, in 2001 approximately 137000 fish were retained by recreation fishos and roughly 36000 were discarded. While you may be doing the morally correct thing in releasing the majority of your catch and only keeping larger specimens, the vast majority of the angling public don't.

Restrictions should not only apply to the recreational sector. The commercial sector and even the fishing techniques of other industries that impact mulloway populations (like the prawning industry) need to be reviewed and control measures implemented to avoid the decline of the mulloway fishery.

Mulloway unlike Snapper are a schooling fish. Which makes them particularly vulnerable to overfishing, especially during thier spawning aggregations. Hence why a closed season for recreational and commercial fishing should be considered to protect this spawning stock.

[reyzor]

im all for conserving the species..... but do you really think that these "majority" of fishos will abide by the rules... the majority of fishos dont have lisences.....

[barnzey]

Your statement has knobs all over it...

Here's a bit of education for you Mulloway status Pay close attention to table 2.3. on the comparison between recreational and commercial catches. Now i don't confess to be a mathematician, but its is a little more than 1%. What is also interesting to note is the mean size of the fish caught. If you continue reading it states, in 2001 approximately 137000 fish were retained by recreation fishos and roughly 36000 were discarded. While you may be doing the morally correct thing in releasing the majority of your catch and only keeping larger specimens, the vast majority of the angling public don't.

Restrictions should not only apply to the recreational sector. The commercial sector and even the fishing techniques of other industries that impact mulloway populations (like the prawning industry) need to be reviewed and control measures implemented to avoid the decline of the mulloway fishery.

Mulloway unlike Snapper are a schooling fish. Which makes them particularly vulnerable to overfishing, especially during thier spawning aggregations. Hence why a closed season for recreational and commercial fishing should be considered to protect this spawning stock.

Thanks for that Dan, it really goes to show that recreational fishing has a real impact on fish stocks. I hope everyone reads this as it shows a lot of research has gone into assessing jewfish stocks and that there is a lot of evidence supporting changes in bag and size limits.

I've just heard that the proposed changes in bag and size limits was knocked back yesterday...

[Luringbream]

Your statement has knobs all over it...

Here's a bit of education for you Mulloway status Pay close attention to table 2.3. on the comparison between recreational and commercial catches. Now i don't confess to be a mathematician, but its is a little more than 1%. What is also interesting to note is the mean size of the fish caught. If you continue reading it states, in 2001 approximately 137000 fish were retained by recreation fishos and roughly 36000 were discarded. While you may be doing the morally correct thing in releasing the majority of your catch and only keeping larger specimens, the vast majority of the angling public don't.

Restrictions should not only apply to the recreational sector. The commercial sector and even the fishing techniques of other industries that impact mulloway populations (like the prawning industry) need to be reviewed and control measures implemented to avoid the decline of the mulloway fishery.

Mulloway unlike Snapper are a schooling fish. Which makes them particularly vulnerable to overfishing, especially during thier spawning aggregations. Hence why a closed season for recreational and commercial fishing should be considered to protect this spawning stock.

This is exactly what i expected that link to show. That document is dated 2005, and the table is based on data and estimates from 2001/2002. You need up to date information to make your argument plausible, until then, continue learning how to tie knots and cast a rod.

And you say Snapper arn't a schooling fish? You have no idea, I almost feel sorry for you. Obviously your experiences govern that decision

Before you come on here and throw words like 'knob' around, get yours facts straight. And stop insulting yourself. You have clearly misunderstood my intial response.

[outdoordan]

The phrase "knobs all over it" refers to your statement having flaws. There is no reason to get your panties in a knot. I've never met you or fished with you and you tell me to learn to tie knots and learn to cast. Wake up. If you can't debate something without getting all worked up then maybe you should grab your bat and ball.

The document is dated 2005. But the infomation gathered over the 50years prior depicts a trend. Considering the bag/size limits and commercial fishing practices have remained unchanged for the past 7 years, it is pretty fair to assume those trends continue until present, and wouldn't take a rocket scientist to forcast future trends if controls aren't implemented.

I don't target snapper, I haven't researched snapper, and i wouldn't give input on the management stragies of snapper. However i do fish for mulloway, i have studied mulloway and have caught plenty of them. If you can come up with a good argument i would look forward debating it with you. I don't wish to debate snapper.

Edited May 4, 2012 by OutdoorDan

[bergo]

I think an increased size limit would just make it like the rat kings in the harbour your average size fish would go from 400mm-450mm to say the size limit is 650mm the average fish would slowly build upto 600mm-650mm

[outdoordan]

At least that would enable these fish to spawn before they are harvested.

[bassboy888]

I think an increased size limit would just make it like the rat kings in the harbour your average size fish would go from 400mm-450mm to say the size limit is 650mm the average fish would slowly build upto 600mm-650mm

i wouldnt mind if the average jew size increased though But yes increasing the legal size could allow these fish to spawn once or twice before being taken for a meal.