The nightmare continues - Gasket gone and dead outboard

[jgrant666]

G'day raiders and happy new year

Just got back from Merimbula having cut our trip short due to a combination of things going wrong. Anyways, after my impeller problems I thought all was well but nope, put the boat in at Pambula lake and it kicked over but wouldn't power up then died, took it to a local boat mechanic down there who said I've got a leak in either the head or exhaust Gasket, and water in the cylinders. Quoted me 1-2k to fix depending on how long it takes to pull apart. We had to get back for a funeral so had to decline. He also said the throttle cable is almost gone and needs replacing [emoji29]

I'm not very mechanical but my father in law up in Coffs is and has offered to help me try and fix it. My first question is what do you reckon parts might run to? And can anyone recommend a good supplier? I'm thinking it would be a 2 day job? Any particular tips or things I should be mindful of when attempting to fix it?

If we can't fix it then I've either gotta find a decent but cheap marine mechanic so pm suggestions would be appreciated. Happy to travel out of Sydney if need be. Otherwise may have to get rid of the boat, we only spent 4.5k on it so I really can't justify spending too much more on it especially after all the recent hassles. I'm a bit concerned about the motor seizing now too if water has gotten into the bearings.

Motor is an 82 Johnson 70hp

Oh and to cap it all off I didn't even get to wet a bloody line while I was down there [emoji35]

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Edited December 31, 2015 by jgrant666

[stevefish]

Give up on it. Once something is unreliable you can't get it back

[Brooker435]

Don't give up on it just yet, I would at least get the father in law to have a look at it.

If it is just a head gasket it wont be a costly repair and there's no harm in tearing it down, as long as you have a idea about what you're doing.

depending on how mechanical your father in law is you may be able to fix it.

I had a 1975 Evinrude 50 on my first boat and had the thermostat seize on it and the head gasket had a whopping big hole in it and I fixed it myself for about $150 and it never missed a beat after that.

Unfortunately being a old motor you dont know what maintenance has been done on it and its very easy to say its old and unreliable but once you get the bugs out of it providing it still has good compression you will get a few more years out of it

as far as parts are concerned most of the boat dealers can get parts for you being a Johnson parts will be readily available as long as you get the serial number off the motor the dealers should be able to work out the exact year and can get exploded views of parts for that motor and work out what you need.

Best of luck and feel free to send me a pm if you need anything.

Regards,

Nathan

[DrownNprawns]

Problems can be fixed.

Things that can go wrong!

Bolts and nuts can be seized and brake off.

Head may have a crack so pressure testing is a must.

And a hole lot more little things.

You may be able to get a reco power head.

Things can go easy as well so have a good plan b4 you start.

Good luck with it any way

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[jgrant666]

Thanks Nathan, compression luckily was fine when they checked it over in Merimbula, 140 on all 3 cylinders. I've got the model number which confirms it's an 82 one. Glad to hear your evinrude kicked on after its Gasket went

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[Fab1]

I would rebuild the power head completely if I were you and couldn't afford a brand new engine.You need to realise that you have a 33 yr old engine.Under a grand buys you everything you need in parts/gaskets and some machining.

When things like head gaskets go its not good practice to simply replace as nine times out of ten it will blow again in the not to distant future,you need to find out why it blew the first time(Normally because of overheating due to corroded water galleries,defective impellers,radiators etc)depending weather we are talking outboards or inboards.As Nathan says those outboards are as common as Corollas and finding parts should not be too difficult.A good workshop manual is a must if your not confidant in performing the work on your own and if your not perhaps consider giving the job to someone such as our site sponsor shire marine to perform the work for peace of mind.Bear in mind that if you muck it up your on your own (but you learn from it hopefully)as passing the work on to someone else you have the peace of mind that you get some sort of warranty for the work performed.

After a quick search online this is what you need for your engine-

Good luck with it whichever way you decide to go.

[Brooker435]

Thanks Nathan, compression luckily was fine when they checked it over in Merimbula, 140 on all 3 cylinders. I've got the model number which confirms it's an 82 one. Glad to hear your evinrude

kicked on after its Gasket went

Hi Grant, just to clarify.

My Evinrude was running fine until I got the overheat alarm and it cut out and started again when it cooled down. my issue was the thermostat not opening. the head gasket was only found by chance as I decided to dig abit further whilst I was fixing the outboard And found a problem. There was abit of sand and crap around the hole so I gave everything a good clean and put it all back together I got off pretty easy id say my issue was caused by the motor not being flushed perhaps who knows.

as Fab1 mentioned the books are quite handy I think I still have my book for the evinrude it may cover yours ill have a look for it and if I can find it youre welcome to borrow it.

Regards,

Nathan

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Edited January 1, 2016 by beginner

[batfishing]

Thanks Nathan, compression luckily was fine when they checked it over in Merimbula, 140 on all 3 cylinders. I've got the model number which confirms it's an 82 one. Glad to hear your evinrude kicked on after its Gasket went

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With equal compression like that on each cylinder, I wouldn't be concerned about having to go to deep, and their diagnosis of a gasket is probably correct, and as said $150 in parts should cover that.

It's not that hard a job, particularly if your father in law has offered to help and is mechanical.

With the age of that outboard, take a trip to your local library, it's quite likely they may have a service manual for it.

If so, borrow it, photocopy the required pages, as it doesn't matter then if you get oil etc on them.

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[Brooker435]

I knew I still had my book. unfortunately it only goes upto 60 hp 2 cyl. If you wanted to borrow it theres no worries however Your better off with the correct manual. how many cylinders is your outboard?

Regards,

Nathan

[ambrose607]

Fleabay has over 50 Johnson repair manuals. Surely one of them is what your after. Hope it all goes well.

[fredflathead]

I have a outboard shop manual Evinrude/johnson 48-235hp 1973-1990.

It is yours as I now have a 90hp etec brand new for my 38yr old boat.

I had the same problem as you with a Evinrude 90hp, I then was given a 115hp Johnson and still had problems, my brother in law is a retired marine engineer and in the end we could not find the problem if was overheating we change the thermostat and impeller and coils so we put it in for a service and they found a scratch cylinder we did not want to dig to deep..

The cost of the repair would have been in the 4k mark, it was an 82 115hp, I could have got a 15yr motor for about the same price. My lovely wife asked how much for a new motor they said 12k OK put it on. Now when I got revived from the floor, the service manager said the hull was in very good condition so it would be OK to replace motor as I was not throwing money away.

I am retired and had my super and other money which helped a great deal.

We spent about 1k on the 115hp and ran out of time as the brother in law had other commitments so that is why we got a service to see what was wrong as they deal with outboards all the time and could fine the problem faster than us of a weekend.

You are quite welcome to the outboard shop manual, pm me if you want it.

norm

[jgrant666]

thanks to everyone for their tips and assistance. Think I'll give it a go myself whilst the offer of help from my father in law is there

20160101_161815.jpg

I knew I still had my book. unfortunately it only goes upto 60 hp 2 cyl. If you wanted to borrow it theres no worries however Your better off with the correct manual. how many cylinders is your outboard?

Regards,

Nathan

Thanks Nathan, mine's a 3cyl but luckily FredFlathead has the correct book so that's one thing sorted!

With equal compression like that on each cylinder, I wouldn't be concerned about having to go to deep, and their diagnosis of a gasket is probably correct, and as said $150 in parts should cover that.
It's not that hard a job, particularly if your father in law has offered to help and is mechanical.
With the age of that outboard, take a trip to your local library, it's quite likely they may have a service manual for it.
If so, borrow it, photocopy the required pages, as it doesn't matter then if you get oil etc on them.


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Thanks Ian! as mentioned I've been sorted out with a manual, I'd already had the impeller done so I'm hoping if I replace the head and exhaust gaskets and otherwise give everything a good clean down with acetone then re-lube it'll come good

I would rebuild the power head completely if I were you and couldn't afford a brand new engine.You need to realise that you have a 33 yr old engine.Under a grand buys you everything you need in parts/gaskets and some machining.
When things like head gaskets go its not good practice to simply replace as nine times out of ten it will blow again in the not to distant future,you need to find out why it blew the first time(Normally because of overheating due to corroded water galleries,defective impellers,radiators etc)depending weather we are talking outboards or inboards.As Nathan says those outboards are as common as Corollas and finding parts should not be too difficult.A good workshop manual is a must if your not confidant in performing the work on your own and if your not perhaps consider giving the job to someone such as our site sponsor shire marine to perform the work for peace of mind.Bear in mind that if you muck it up your on your own (but you learn from it hopefully)as passing the work on to someone else you have the peace of mind that you get some sort of warranty for the work performed.

After a quick search online this is what you need for your engine-image.jpg

Good luck with it whichever way you decide to go.

Thanks Fab. Gonna give it a go but I had a quick look and those rebuild kits seemed to be round the $800 mark, I think for now I'll try the gaskets and pay lots of attention whilst we pull it apart, might look at the full rebuild and/or a new powerhead (which seemed to be about the same price as the rebuild kit) if the gaskets don't do the trick. If the compression is still ok fingers crossed it isn't too bad.

I have to say though it just goes to show what a great community this is, so supportive with tips and advice. Hopefully I can put some faces to names @ the next social!

[Brooker435]

Best of Luck JGrant,

Be sure to upload some photos of it when you do tear it down, would be very interesting to see what you find.

I would replace the thermostat whilst it is apart but if you don't want to, put it in a pot of water and stick it on the cook top in your kitchen wait for the water to boil to check if the thermostat opens, if it opens that indicates that it is working, let it cool down and check to see if it has closed again.

totally up to you but I would replace it.

I really hope you can get these issues sorted out and get back out there fishing.

When I bought my first boat it was very De-moralising as I had allot of issues with my outboard at the beginning but once I got all the bugs out of it happy days,

Regards,

Nathan

Edited January 1, 2016 by beginner

[jgrant666]

Thanks Nathan, that's a great tip. The whole problem started with sand in the intakes that got into the impeller and pulled it off the shaft so fingers crossed the thermostat is ok, but I'll definitely be testing it on your advice!

Just curious though if anyone knows about throttle cables. I would think you've got the main one, plus one for the fast idle lever, the gear selector, choke and the trim controls and kill switch. Is it a single unit or multiple cables and wires just bundled together?

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[jgrant666]

Oh and yes I'll be taking photos of every step to help me make sure everything goes back again so I'll be sure to post a few choice ones

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[Guest 4myson]

Sorry to hear about your headaches with the outboard .... Didn't the mechanic who did your water pump test it out for a headgasket ??? BTW how'd you go with the hatch ???

[jgrant666]

Sorry to hear about your headaches with the outboard .... Didn't the mechanic who did your water pump test it out for a headgasket ??? BTW how'd you go with the hatch ???

Thanks Sasha! Hope you've managed to wet a line at least with your little one!

As you saw the frame is pretty bent, I couldn't quite get the new perspex to sit in it nicely so that it would close properly. For now I've just siliconed it onto the top of the frame, then when I get some time I'll see if I can either shave the perspex down a bit so that the frame goes round it properly, or maybe remove the frame entirely and use the hinges and latches from it to attach the perspex directly with some window rubbers to ensure a good seal

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[jgrant666]

Oh and well yes I thought the bloke I took the motor too did check everything, we ran it for a good 5-10 minutes at his place and it seemed ok. It was a long and bumpy drive to Merimbula though so maybe the Gasket was borderline and the long trip was the final nail in the coffin for it. Not in a huge rush to use that mechanic again though!

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[sconner6062]

Good luck mate, same thing happened on my old yamaha, replaced head gasket for 150 bucks! If your gonna replace that, may as well replace water jacket gaskets and clean out the water jacket as well, get rid of anny build up of salt over the years, no matter how much you flush em, you will get some in there, and once its gone, you will notice a massive difference in water flow from your tell tale! Have fun mate!

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[jgrant666]

Good luck mate, same thing happened on my old yamaha, replaced head gasket for 150 bucks! If your gonna replace that, may as well replace water jacket gaskets and clean out the water jacket as well, get rid of anny build up of salt over the years, no matter how much you flush em, you will get some in there, and once its gone, you will notice a massive difference in water flow from your tell tale! Have fun mate!

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Cheers, looks like I can get a pack with all the major gaskets so may as well! Is your yammy running well for a good while after now? Also, once the powerhead is off can you test it somehow without having to remount the whole thing? I have a pull start rope for the flywheel but not sure about water n fuel

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[sconner6062]

Ran it for about 9 months/20 hours after rebuild and sold it to a mate as it was very underpowered with 3 blokes in the boat and gear! Got a bigger outboard! Its on my mates 4meter river boat up the murray, still kicking! I wouldnt even bother trying to rig up some conconction! Jut put it back on and tun it up, make sure its torqued up properly, my yamaha had torque settings on head and jackets plus in manual as well! If you know how to use a torrent site, you can download all old johnson/evinrude manuals from there!

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[jeffb5.8]

if you get stuck for any tools, drop me a message i am in Dundas so nice and close

[jgrant666]

if you get stuck for any tools, drop me a message i am in Dundas so nice and close

Legend, thanks again! I'll see how I go in Coffs next week but may well take you up on that!

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[antonywardle]

Hi mate

I had a similar path to you. Like FredFlathead, mine came with a broken 90HP and the quote to get it going was pretty high.

I got a second hand 120HP looper and that was good. It was a little too heavy for my boat but it flew. 77km/hr

I ended up getting myself a second hand ETEC 90HP and I love it.

I sold the dead 90 and the good 120 last weekend to a mechanic in Cessnock of all places.

He had the 90 running in two days and it turned out it was in pretty good condition which is a bit different to what

the first mechanic told me. It was down on pressure in 1 cylinder because of a scratch of the wall.

If you find someone you can trust then go with them.

What boat do you have?

Cheers

Antony

[jgrant666]

Thanks antony, it's a sportsmancraft 4.6m fibreglass half cabin, early 80s model but the hull is solid. Only paid 4.5k for it and my wife was just made redundant so I can't really justify a whole new or 2nd hand motor atm. I've ordered a Gasket kit that fingers crossed arrives tomorrow so hopefully with my father in law we'll be able to get her running in the next couple of days. I figure worst comes to worst if we've at least dissembled it and have the parts I've saved half the labour if I do end up having to get a pro fix it.

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