macca02

Quintrex Renegade: 420 or 440?

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Hi all,

Looking at upgrading from my current 13ft savage tinny and have narrowed it down to getting either a Quintrex Renegade (either the 420 or 440) Tiller Steer model.

I mostly fish solo and inside Brisbane waters flicking lures for estuary species. Though on a calm day would want the ability to duck over and fish pittwater/Hawkesbury/headlands from Brisbane waters (Which I currently can't really do with any confidence) and have some confidence in making it back if the weather turns nasty.

I'm not looking to do any real offshore work, just be able to chase king's/squid in Pittwater, troll lives around the headlands and fish for Jew in the Hawkesbury.

I'm torn between the 420 and 440 renegade. Obviously the 440 would be a little better for the outside stuff and have more room.

Downsides is it'd be heavier and maybe harder to launch and retrieve on my own?, and more expensive.

I want something that's easy to take out and handle by myself.

Anyone have any experience with either of these boats (or fish the areas mentioned), would love to get your thoughts!

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I have a Stacer Outlaw 449 side console, so similar boat but slightly bigger than the 440 Renegade and heavier than a tiller steer. I also carry a lot of gear as I like to be prepared for anything. 60hp Evinrude ETEC, 50l under floor fuel tank, sometimes a 25l aux tank, up to 8 rods and reels, landing net, gaff, heap of lures, 50l esky and ice, live bait tank, which I usually always fill, Minn Kota, 2-3 anchors and 200m of rope, etc.   I have no problem launching and retrieving on my own. 😉

Edited by Berleyguts
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I have a 420 side console with Mercury 50hp and MotorGuide - I only fish lures and  mostly fish solo at least twice a week in Tuggerah lakes, Lake Macquarie or estuaries up the mid north coast. I do occasionally launch at Patonga and fish Pittwater, Broken Bay as well as Glenbawn.  I don't fish offshore but the boat has comfortably handled some shocking conditions on large waterways. It also has a quite a  shallow draught for the hull type and I can put it onto to some shallow water when fishing flats.

If I was purchasing another boat, I'd probably go tiller steer just because it provides more usable space compared to the side console. Its by no means a perfect boat but must be pretty good when my biggest gripe is that I wish it didn't have an anchor well so the front casting deck was bigger.

I doubt if there would be a noticeable difference when launching/retrieving a 420 or a 440 so its more about the size you need - if you fish mostly solo, the 420 is fine. Lure fishing with 2 works well but the few times I've been out with 3 in the boat, available space isn't great.

Looks like you're on the coast, PM me if you'd like to chat more or if you'd like to go for a run in it, I'm sure we could work out a time for a quick fish.

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I have recently upgraded to a Renegade 460 side console.

No problem launching and retrieving solo.

The 420 & 440 just seemed a bit small for what I wanted which was essentially the same as you but with a few offshore trips thrown in as well.

Keep in mind any tiller steer will not have an enclosed transom leaving the rear vulnerable to wash coming into the boat either when stopping quickly or if there is a bit of chop about.

I do a lot of shallow water fishing (less than a meter) and haven't any problems with hull depth yet.

 

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There's quite a big jump from the 420 to the 440, it is a much bigger boat, and bigger trailer with brakes, so, there's a bit to consider.

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not exactly on point, but I went to Lion Island yesterday, half metre swell, light winds in my old fibreglass 15 foot runabout, then ,moved on down to Patonga,. then the wind and swell picked up, near 1m and 35 kph winds, slow and wet trip back into Pittwater, so it can get nasty real fast, the winds came in over an hour earlier than expected. We survived no problem, just got sprayed a lot. Id suggest a bigger deeper hull boat or hope the conditions dont change too fast.

 

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I have a renegade 420 sc and have had it in some rough weather without any dramas but then I've got 40yrs experience in boats They are not vulnerable to wash coming over the transom if you know what your doing I fish solo quite often My only regret is not getting it rerated to 60hp

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Not too sure about this "open transom" business, the Renegade has a splash well, can't see it being an issue compared to a front/side/centre steer.

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21 hours ago, Hill373737 said:

I have a 420 side console with Mercury 50hp and MotorGuide - I only fish lures and  mostly fish solo at least twice a week in Tuggerah lakes, Lake Macquarie or estuaries up the mid north coast. I do occasionally launch at Patonga and fish Pittwater, Broken Bay as well as Glenbawn.  I don't fish offshore but the boat has comfortably handled some shocking conditions on large waterways. It also has a quite a  shallow draught for the hull type and I can put it onto to some shallow water when fishing flats.

If I was purchasing another boat, I'd probably go tiller steer just because it provides more usable space compared to the side console. Its by no means a perfect boat but must be pretty good when my biggest gripe is that I wish it didn't have an anchor well so the front casting deck was bigger.

I doubt if there would be a noticeable difference when launching/retrieving a 420 or a 440 so its more about the size you need - if you fish mostly solo, the 420 is fine. Lure fishing with 2 works well but the few times I've been out with 3 in the boat, available space isn't great.

Looks like you're on the coast, PM me if you'd like to chat more or if you'd like to go for a run in it, I'm sure we could work out a time for a quick fish.

Legend! Thanks mate that's really helpful, would love to take you up on the offer for a quick fish out of it! I have a first baby coming at any moment so for the next month I'm probably not going to have a lot of free time. But I'll shoot you a PM!

19 hours ago, Renegade460 said:

I have recently upgraded to a Renegade 460 side console.

No problem launching and retrieving solo.

The 420 & 440 just seemed a bit small for what I wanted which was essentially the same as you but with a few offshore trips thrown in as well.

Keep in mind any tiller steer will not have an enclosed transom leaving the rear vulnerable to wash coming into the boat either when stopping quickly or if there is a bit of chop about.

I do a lot of shallow water fishing (less than a meter) and haven't any problems with hull depth yet.

 

I was also looking at the 460s as I was told a lot of people start with a 420 and end up getting a 460 for more room/offshore capability, though realistically (and budget wise also) I think 95% of my use would be estuary fishing solo with only a little bit of just venturing out but staying in close. I've done some offshore fishing in mates boats/charters and its not my thing(at this stage anyway). Great to know in the 460 you can still get in shallow water as I do like to do some bream flats fishing in the shallows.

11 hours ago, noelm said:

There's quite a big jump from the 420 to the 440, it is a much bigger boat, and bigger trailer with brakes, so, there's a bit to consider.

Whichever one I get I think I'd option up to get a braked trailer as my tow vehicle is a 4 cylinder 2001 Subaru outback, I think it only has approx 600kg unbraked towing capacity. I imagine hull + motor + trailer + fuel/batteries/electric motor/gear would be pushing it?

9 hours ago, The Iceman said:

I have a renegade 420 sc and have had it in some rough weather without any dramas but then I've got 40yrs experience in boats They are not vulnerable to wash coming over the transom if you know what your doing I fish solo quite often My only regret is not getting it rerated to 60hp

That's probably the biggest thing I've read about them (rerating) with alot of people suggesting to get them rerated and get a 60HP yam for the 420 and a 70HP yam for the 440. Are you able to rerate from new? I'm looking at getting a boat package new from a dealer.

Bit of a stupid question for everyone, I'm used to having a light tinny (it's about half the width of a 420) that I can push against the wind to get it straight for the trailer or if I pull onto a beach to grab lunch and the tide goes down a bit I can drag it back out.

With a bigger/heavier boat what do you do in those situations? E.g. fighting against the wind at the boat ramp to get your boat on straight?(are the trailers setup so they just guide the boat on straight with ease, or do you have ropes attached to the rear to straighten it up), or if you're beaching the boat and the tide goes down a bit are you stuffed without help from someone else?

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If the trailer is OK, and in the right depth, any of them are easy to launch and retrieve single handed, not too sure about needing to get them rerated, most are fine with near the max recommended HP.

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I'm sure you can get it rerated from the factory I drive mine on and off the trailer as long as its set up properly mine was shit from the dealer The new latches they have on the trailers now will make it easier Too heavy to push off a beach if its stuck good

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20 minutes ago, noelm said:

If the trailer is OK, and in the right depth, any of them are easy to launch and retrieve single handed, not too sure about needing to get them rerated, most are fine with near the max recommended HP.

Agreed on trailer setup, I had to mod mine a bit OT make it easier to launch-retrieve
to be honest, Im not sure how heavy those boats are, but I can launch - retrieve my old fibreglass boat on my own, and Id say its heavier

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1 hour ago, macca02 said:

... Bit of a stupid question for everyone, I'm used to having a light tinny (it's about half the width of a 420) that I can push against the wind to get it straight for the trailer or if I pull onto a beach to grab lunch and the tide goes down a bit I can drag it back out.

With a bigger/heavier boat what do you do in those situations? E.g. fighting against the wind at the boat ramp to get your boat on straight?(are the trailers setup so they just guide the boat on straight with ease, or do you have ropes attached to the rear to straighten it up), or if you're beaching the boat and the tide goes down a bit are you stuffed without help from someone else?

Not a stupid question at all!

With my 449 Outlaw, if it’s windy, I will either drive the boat onto the trailer, or use 2 ropes. This will depend on the ramp, too. I don’t have a boat catch so if I drive on, I have to manoeuvre pretty quickly to clip the winch strap on and then I have to clamber down (getting a bit old for that!). With the 2 rope system, I use a 5m bow rope and a 10m stern rope. I use the stern rope to keep the blunt end straight, while keeping tension on the bow rope. I wrap it around the winch post a few times, then winch with one hand while maintaining tension on the stern rope. Works pretty well for me.

As for getting beached, yes, I do struggle if I get beached sideways in certain conditions. I had a bit of trouble last week when I pulled up on Shoal Bay beach with a bit of surge to pick up my cousin and his wife to spot dolphins. I had planned to pick them up from the jetty but the tide was low and my cousin’s wife went for six on the steps, cutting her leg on the oysters. I was in a bit of a rush to get to shore and render first aid. What I should have done, was drop the anchor and reverse in, then run the stern anchor out. You learn what works best for your boat and situation.

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On 2/26/2020 at 6:00 PM, macca02 said:

Legend! Thanks mate that's really helpful, would love to take you up on the offer for a quick fish out of it! I have a first baby coming at any moment so for the next month I'm probably not going to have a lot of free time. But I'll shoot you a PM!

 

Whichever one I get I think I'd option up to get a braked trailer as my tow vehicle is a 4 cylinder 2001 Subaru outback, I think it only has approx 600kg unbraked towing capacity. I imagine hull + motor + trailer + fuel/batteries/electric motor/gear would be pushing it?

 

That's probably the biggest thing I've read about them (rerating) with alot of people suggesting to get them rerated and get a 60HP yam for the 420 and a 70HP yam for the 440. Are you able to rerate from new? I'm looking at getting a boat package new from a dealer.

 

No worries, good luck with the birth of your first, just PM when you're ready and we'll work something out.

I bought my 420 2nd hand and it came with a braked trailer with a walkway, makes it a lot easier to retrieve the boat being able to walk down the trailer.

You'd have to weigh up the extra cost of rerating and more $$ for the motor  against the benefit - in good conditions in estuaries, mine is fairly happy at 20 knots and if I'm in a hurry, can get a bit more if I want to push it harder. I run a 4 blade prop as well  so have lost a bit of top end speed but it gets out of the hole easier and onto the plane.

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For the areas you have mentioned I reckon the Quintrex Busta or similar is a better hull. At the 420 and 440 size I looked at the renegades and the gunwhales are below my knees which in my mind is easy to trip over and into the drink. The busta has the foam in the seats (not the floor) so the gunwhales are higher.

box head/barrenjoey headland can get pretty sloppy when the weather turns.

if you’re really set on the renegade the 460 is heaps safer- gunwhales are a good height.

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23 hours ago, flatheadluke said:

For the areas you have mentioned I reckon the Quintrex Busta or similar is a better hull. At the 420 and 440 size I looked at the renegades and the gunwhales are below my knees which in my mind is easy to trip over and into the drink. The busta has the foam in the seats (not the floor) so the gunwhales are higher.

box head/barrenjoey headland can get pretty sloppy when the weather turns.

if you’re really set on the renegade the 460 is heaps safer- gunwhales are a good height.

Thanks mate. I initially looked at the Busta and Dory models but personally I just can't get past their floor design. 

I get that it has it benefits with stability & safety being much lower, though for me the floor being open and not snug/boarded up is a real annoyance which I've previously experienced (sinkers/gear falling under, fish getting under the gap between the floor and the seat).

One of the first mods I did with my current tinny was to put a false floor in which was snug/sealed to the sides then after using it for a couple of years I boarded up under the bench seats because it was a pain with having things fall through. I feel like I'd be taking a step back in floor layout with something like the Busta and be wanting to pull up the floor and put a new one.

The floor design, beam and heavier duty style of the renegades is what's got me drawn to that style of boat.

I'll have to take a look at the 460 in person, it does seem the most future proof in a way incase my fishing style changes (e.g. some soft offshore work), Though I'm just worried it'll be too "big" for %95 of my fishing and be more expensive to buy & run and more cumbersome for me to handle on my own & tow.

I know too many people that have bigger boats (Admittantly bigger than 4.6) and don't take them out often because it can be more of an effort to do so solo. I want something cheap to run and relatively easy to tow and that If I only have a few hour window I can duck out for a quick fish without it being too much of a hassle.

I'm leaning towards the 440 TS at the moment but still probably a couple of months before I can purchase so plenty of time for me to keep changing my mind haha.

Cheers for everyones input so far it's been super helpful!

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48 minutes ago, macca02 said:

Thanks mate. I initially looked at the Busta and Dory models but personally I just can't get past their floor design. 

I get that it has it benefits with stability & safety being much lower, though for me the floor being open and not snug/boarded up is a real annoyance which I've previously experienced (sinkers/gear falling under, fish getting under the gap between the floor and the seat).

One of the first mods I did with my current tinny was to put a false floor in which was snug/sealed to the sides then after using it for a couple of years I boarded up under the bench seats because it was a pain with having things fall through. I feel like I'd be taking a step back in floor layout with something like the Busta and be wanting to pull up the floor and put a new one.

The floor design, beam and heavier duty style of the renegades is what's got me drawn to that style of boat.

I'll have to take a look at the 460 in person, it does seem the most future proof in a way incase my fishing style changes (e.g. some soft offshore work), Though I'm just worried it'll be too "big" for %95 of my fishing and be more expensive to buy & run and more cumbersome for me to handle on my own & tow.

I know too many people that have bigger boats (Admittantly bigger than 4.6) and don't take them out often because it can be more of an effort to do so solo. I want something cheap to run and relatively easy to tow and that If I only have a few hour window I can duck out for a quick fish without it being too much of a hassle.

I'm leaning towards the 440 TS at the moment but still probably a couple of months before I can purchase so plenty of time for me to keep changing my mind haha.

Cheers for everyones input so far it's been super helpful!

Yep that open floor is a pain in the neck

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18 hours ago, macca02 said:

I know too many people that have bigger boats (Admittantly bigger than 4.6) and don't take them out often because it can be more of an effort to do so solo. I want something cheap to run and relatively easy to tow and that If I only have a few hour window I can duck out for a quick fish without it being too much of a hassle.

I can totally agree with this to a point, especially if they have a older F/g boat, then it can become a pain to go for a quick session.

I upgraded from a 4,2 tinny to a new 539 Stacer,  the 539 is way easier to launch and retrieve and attached to the car is almost as easy. I drive on and off the trailer unless the swell is running at Shoalbay.

The only down side between the two was I would tie the tinny up and not worry about it bashing into the wharf as it was old and scratched, the new boat I have 3 bumpers and race the car to park it and race back to the wharf to try and prevent scratches.

I would go the 460, just for the future proof, larger HP and extra room, running cost would be less than $100 extra per year but also remember you buy the boat for you not your mates as they rarely come out anyway.

 

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Here is my 420 when I'm fishing solo which is about 90% of the time - I take the 2nd seat out to make extra room and its easy to move between the front and rear casting decks. Its also easier to net fish while standing on the floor so frees up space for that.

IMG_0864.jpeg

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